Pitchfork’s interview with the fleet-fingered Marnie Stern is chock-full of interesting material–her creative process, how she almost named her new album after a line from Arrested Development only to have St. Vincent beat her to it, the heart-cheering tidbit that she’s working on something with fellow guitar goddess Mary Timony (!!!). But I really liked the part where she described how the sometimes-alienating experience of going to shows alone and dealing with the attendant, excruciating “shop talk” with semi-strangers wound up plunging her into a period of crazy creativity:
Pitchfork: What kind of shows were you going to?
MS: Well, Brownies was really popular, and I was going to all the underground…Todd P shows, Lightning Bolt shows, all of those kind of shows, and I’d go by myself and I’d stand around. Erase Errata, I remember seeing at some weird place, and I’d stand around, like once a week, stand around, just very awkward. It’s very awkward.
Pitchfork: I know how you feel. It’s weird to go to those kind of shows alone because there are all these social things going on around you…
MS: And you’re bored!
Pitchfork: Yeah, just kinda waiting for the things to start. Everyone is either enveloped in what they are doing, with the people they are talking to, or way too shy to deal with anyone else.
MS: Exactly. And I felt, it was really the in-between, just standing there and I’d be so bored, and this was before, like, I had a cell phone. Or most people had a cell phone. And I was just standing there, so I’d try to talk to people, and people would just be like, ‘Oh.” Or they’d be like, “So what do you do?” And I’d be like, “I play music.” “Oh, really, what label are you on?” “None.” “Oh.” It sucked! It sucked, it sucked, it sucked. And I used to call my best friend and be like “Ooooooooooh!” She calls it a “facial disgracial.” Like, “Ohhhhhhh, I want to show those people someday, damn it!” She was watching Network, and there’s a scene, the guy is like, “I’m mad as hell and I’m not gonna take it anymore!” And so we called our little thing Mad as Hell, like, “Fuck this shit, we’re mad as hell! What the fuck!” So we went into this crazy little world. No socializing, just reading constantly, we were nerds, nerds, nerds. And that was when the biggest creative surge of my life happened, and nothing like that has ever happened since. My mind was open. Open to anything and everything, and that was the best two years of my whole life. You want to get back to it, but it’s just not there anymore.
Maybe this just speaks to me because I’ve been trying to cultivate my hermit side lately (hey, it has the side effect of being very very cheap!), although I guess I should quit watching the Tabatha’s Salon Takeover reruns and pick up a book. (Well, I guess I can watch the Long Island ones for further creative inspiration for any endeavors based on my roots. Ha ha, no pun intended!)
Interview: Marnie Stern [Pitchfork]
I don’t really understand the quote. Did she stop going to shows, or did she just stop trying socialize with strangers at them? And what does that have to do with creativity?
Wow, she seems like a real bitch. Sorry if no one wanted to talk to you about your lame music. If it sucked,sucked, sucked so bad, maybe she should have stopped going and bringing everyone down.
@Al Shipley: She hunkered down and ignored people who were being dicks to her for not “making it.” (The dickishness could have been colored by her own insecurity at the time, sure, but I’m just saying that I’ve been there and it’s very hampering as far as developing your own personality, trusting your creative instincts, etc.)
@tim_loves_cats: So you’ve never had the “Ani DiFranco problem” (love the band, pity about the fans) with an artist you like? Maybe you need to go to more shows in NYC, because there sure are a lot of jerks around these parts. It makes going out a bit of a chore a lot of the time.
(Also lol @ the likelihood of this thread turning into something i should show my next shrink)
Hey, her and her friend are like the Laverne and Shirley of the blog rock world.
@Maura Johnston: No, I honestly haven’t. If I don’t like the fans, I ignore ‘em and I sure as shit couldn’t care less what they think of my professional life. It’s easy to get self conscious when you’re by yourself but then you realize that no one’s looking around for solo attendees to ridicule. And before you get all “New York is a snarling beast and you couldn’t handle it” on me, let me assure that people can be dickheads in Chicago as well.
@tim_loves_cats: Ha ha, rest assured that I know people can be assholes in Chicago. (And I am not saying that as some backhanded slap at you! I took calls on WNUR for four years.)
@Maura Johnston: Was it your punishment for robbing a liquor store? I’m just kiddin’, I didn’t realize you spent time in the area (or are possibly from the area). I guess as a solo-show-goer I’ve just never run into any problems, and I’ve always either seen no one I knew and kept to myself or seen someone I knew well enough to hang with.
I can remember when I first started going to shows by myself in Philadelphia in the early 90s before I knew anyone yet and how lonely and sort of boring it could be. Lots of kids used to sit on the floor and read or write in journals. I met one of my best friends on a message board where she was complaining about feeling lonely at shows, so we started to hang out. We’re still friends today.
Another one of my friends knew who who I was from the Philly music crit world and was afraid to talk to me for years, which is so silly because I would have been thrilled to know him years later. He told me I looked angry standing up front. I stood up front because I’m short and I probably was angst-ing about something.
Everyone is too caught up in their own shit to worry about others. Thank God for booze.
I guess the thing that I took away from this article in part was how sometimes feeling alienated can cause little bits of doubt to germinate in even the most talented peoples’ minds, and how breaking through that doubt can be invigorating and ultimately satisfying. Not to mention that “scenes” can sometimes be just as rut-inducing as staying in and watching Two And A Half Men, maybe even more so.
One time I called up my friend, and was like “oooohhhhh” and he said “ooooohhhhhh” and then I was like “ahhhhhhhhh”, then we watched Repo Man, and Plate of Shrimp became our thing.
I’m not even sure what she’s talking about here. I find it hard to believe that people would ask if she’s signed, and then would ignore her because she wasn’t. Then again, I’m not from New York so maybe they are that asshole-ish(if so, I’ll just use that to give more steam to my East Coast lament).
Why does she repeat words a lot? She sounds like Renee Zellweger from Jerry Maguire. Either way, at least this snippet made me check out her music just now…I’d never heard her stuff. It’s cool…not sure she’s a guitar goddess, probably more of a guitar w/ lots of pedals goddess, but whoever is playing drums for her shreds and was the best part of the 4 songs I listened to.
Reading that interview made my head hurt. She might be talented, but man, SHUT THE FUCK UP.
Dude, I totally totally identify with this. I go to shows alone all the time, for work and for fun, and it’s always so so so awkward, to be there, drinking, alone, STANDING UP, for hours, just wanting shit to get going. The worst was while I had a girlfriend – she mostly didn’t like going to shows, but I would go, and then I wouldn’t talk to anyone because I would feel guilty about it. Now I don’t because I am too shy. OOOOH MAN IT BLOWS. Hipsters do that “oh” shit to me, too, and I have an actual music industry job. Any answer that isn’t “I’m a millionaire avant-garde visual artist” is basically not cool enough for anyone at a show in NYC. BASTARDS!
I get it. I’m that girl who goes to shows alone all the time. And I’ve had a couple of shows lately where I do like the band but when I get there I am concerned that their fans are assholes. I’ve turned into the girl at the Empty Bottle that brings the New Yorker to read in between sets.
I was at Noah & The Whale a couple of weeks ago and some guy tried to give me shit about staring at the lead singer. First off, yes I thought he was cute in his grungy Elvis Costello glasses wearing way, however I don’t need some random dude to give me crap about crushing on a guy 10 years younger than myself.
Wow. I’ve never been to a show in NYC, and above I wasn’t sure if Marnie’s story was exactly true or not(as far as people being that dumb), but from some of these posts I guess I’ll give her the benefit of the doubt.
What I’m going to take away from this is that if you’re at a show in NY, and you feel alienated, you’re probably doing something right.
As a resident of New York City, I often attend shows alone. Unless the person I’m going with is super-psyched about the band as well, I’d rather be by myself. Plus when the crowd gets kind of “crazy” (like at Rise Against last night) most people 21+ seem to not be able to handle it.
Also BlackBerry’s Brick Breaker game has been great for in-between sets.
@2ironic4u: I’m a 2 Across girl, myself:
[www.appstoreapps.com]
Sometime I go to shows alone (usually in those cases where the missus doesn’t share the same enthusiasm for a band that I do). But I always find it an unnerving experience to be a show by myself. And I’m hesitant to try to start up a conversation up with others who are there by themselves, because I have no idea what the response will be. On one hand, we certainly have something in common (we’re there to see the same band), but on the other hand, I don’t want to be thought of as a weirdo. So I just pass the time with a book, waiting for the headliner to appear. (So, if you see a guy at Spaceland with a Kurt Vonnegut paperback in hand, that’s me.)
You people all need to start taking better drugs.
If I were a woman, I’d be considered an an amazing guitar player.
@2ironic4u: spore for blackberry is amazing in this capacity, as well.
@seeohhellbeewhy: minus that extra comma.
Spore as in the EA game Spore? For Blackberry? That’s awesome.
@seeohhellbeewhy: Where can I get it?
@Audif Jackson Winters III: Good grief! Amen to that. Put down the black berry and pick up a good bit of blue berry.
@Thesemodernsocks: what about
Perhaps Bloom is the solution. “No I can’t tell you what record label I may or may not be on because I’m too busy creating Eno-esque ambient music on my iPhone.”
@Maura Johnston: I haven’t seen those in years! Still, my faves were Pac-man cereal (“with marshmallows!”):
Part of a nutritious breakfast? Sure…
Personally, I find 90% of everything I’ve read from Marnie Stern in interviews ultra relatable. This may be because I’m (pick as many as you like) nerdy/hermity/too intellectual/obsessive/neurotic, but there’s something that resonates deeply with me about the idea of trying to transform the entire secret life of one’s mind into bottled lightning. I feel like I generally create from the same place and there’s something affirming about seeing someone who proves that it isn’t a dead end. As for hitting shows alone, I’ve done it quite a few times. However, I always have a note/sketchbook with me. If someone wants to give me shit for not having “made it” yet, chances are that they’re an irrelevant wanker. I don’t know, maybe being in LA tempers this some. I mean, The Smell scene is suspicious of outsiders and incipiently cliquey (this is actually a symptom in every DIY scene I’ve ever encountered, so I don’t really fault them for it). However, I wouldn’t say that it’s necessarily mean or exclusive in the way that NY has been heretofore described. Plus, I think there’s a subtle anti-intellectual undercurrent to a lot of the noise/prog scene (some of this is due to the fact that the genre is somewhat invested in mystification). If you talk about ideas in front of a lot of these people, they tend to clam up and think you’re trying to make their “art” less “authentic ” or something. Definiteley a little unwelcoming when you’re sort of accustomed to framing what you do in conceptual terms.
@walter_dean: I’m definitely in the camp that’s OK going to shows alone. I did it for years and years in NYC, and only rarely found it boring (and that was usually because of the typically unpredictable set times). For awhile there I actually was part of one of those NYC music scenes, and half the time I wished for the solitude back. There’s a real freedom in being able to come and go as you please; it’s the same reason movies alone are so much fun. And if you’re a fan of the bands, it’s fairly easy to tune out the cliquishness around you.
I like Marnie Stern too, she seems weird and smart. Going to shows makes me super anxious for some of the same reasons she mentioned.
But, I stopped reading most press about her after all articles last year (year before?) mentioned these three things, in order: 1) she’s a woman, 2) she’s an amazing guitar player, and 3) she’s fucking hot. Repeat #3 at least five times. Yawn.
I don’t understand what is wrong with attending a show alone.I don’t hear or see a band any better with the help of my friends. If I want a social experience, I don’t go see live music. Most of the time I’ve been at shows with other people, there is too much talking during the music.
Yes, there are times when you want to not know anyone at a show when you are running into exes or unpleasant people you’d rather not want to know.
Wow, she’s so forward thinking she left out conventionalities like: melody, rhythm, and tuning. It sounds like a couple of kids with terrible add got together, each snorted an eightball, then a five pound bag of sugar, and then went for an album in one take with no editing or mixing. I guess I’m just Debbie Downer, and don’t get it. But somehow I never thought of Milton Bradly’s Simon™ as musical entertainment.